Comments on: Hunting the Ghost Hunters http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/06/22/hunting-the-ghost-hunters/ The official blog of the Skeptologists Sat, 11 Feb 2012 21:38:44 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: John Gordon http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/06/22/hunting-the-ghost-hunters/#comment-28341 John Gordon Mon, 04 Oct 2010 13:57:43 +0000 http://skepticblog.org/?p=3100#comment-28341 I have had many supernatural experiences I have no doubt that there is another life living among us I do believe in God, one of my stories is hearing his audible voice loud and clear, after not believing the first time and thinking there was a man in my house I screamed "WHAT" and he spoke again and said the same four words. This was 6:00 Good Friday, still daylight He told me what to do and he ended up doing it for me. But I have one ghost story. I have a camera that sees in the dark that views my driveway(I am in the security business). It was July 28 2008 at 10:30 pm. I had just finished powering up this camera. I wanted installed because we were leaving on vacation at 3:00am. When I first powered it up there was a wavering cloud in front of my garage door. I thought first it must be the lights on each side of the door. Going back and forth changing light bulbs to lower wattage and finally taking both light bulbs out completely I still viewed this cloud. I thought maybe heat from my house was causing it. Since it was late Sunday night I could not call technical for an explanation of this camera. For one hour I was going back in forth from my dvr and monitor located in the basement to my driveway in front of the garage. I even had turned off all lights in my house on that side of the house. My last trip down to the monitor and I saw a woman walking into the garage. She stopped, turned her head to scan my garage. I did not think ghost, I thought who was this stranger at 11:30 at night. I was angered at first and then thought this must be my wife. Because it was a new camera that sees in the dark that I had no experience with I accepted not being able to see detail only a white figure. As I started to leave the monitor to go up to the garage the figure proceeded to walk into my garage. I ran up to the garage expecting to see my wife. Evidently she had already gone into the house. I walked in and could not find her. She was upstairs with the kids and had not been outside. I now freaked and ran through the house and outdoors again looking for this person. After not finding anyone I realized that I could view this on the dvr and maybe see where this stranger went next. When I played back all I viewed was the cloud until 11:30 then the cloud left. There was never a figure that recorded. I was upset at first thinking I did not have proof of this image but thought later that if I did record this image I would of always thought it was a person that I never did find. But because it did not record I now new it was a ghost. It has been over two years, the dvr has been recording non stop 24 hours a day and there has never been a cloud there since. I have had many supernatural experiences
I have no doubt that there is another life living among us
I do believe in God, one of my stories is hearing his audible voice
loud and clear, after not believing the first time and thinking there was a man in my house I screamed “WHAT” and he spoke again and said the same four words. This was 6:00 Good Friday, still daylight
He told me what to do and he ended up doing it for me.
But I have one ghost story. I have a camera that sees in the dark that views my driveway(I am in the security business). It was July 28 2008 at 10:30 pm. I had just finished powering up this camera. I wanted installed because we were leaving on vacation at 3:00am. When I first powered it up there was a wavering cloud in front of my garage door. I thought first it must be the lights on each side of the door. Going back and forth changing light bulbs to lower wattage and finally taking both light bulbs out completely I still viewed this cloud. I thought maybe heat from my house was causing it. Since it was late Sunday night I could not call technical for an explanation of this camera. For one hour I was going back in forth from my dvr and monitor located in the basement to my driveway in front of the garage. I even had turned off all lights in my house on that side of the house. My last trip down to the monitor and I saw a woman walking into the garage. She stopped, turned her head to scan my garage. I did not think ghost, I thought who was this stranger at 11:30 at night. I was angered at first and then thought this must be my wife. Because it was a new camera that sees in the dark that I had no experience with I accepted not being able to see detail only a white figure. As I started to leave the monitor to go up to the garage the figure proceeded to walk into my garage. I ran up to the garage expecting to see my wife. Evidently she had already gone into the house. I walked in and could not find her. She was upstairs with the kids and had not been outside. I now freaked and ran through the house and outdoors again looking for this person. After not finding anyone I realized that I could view this on the dvr and maybe see where this stranger went next. When I played back all I viewed was the cloud until 11:30 then the cloud left. There was never a figure that recorded. I was upset at first thinking I did not have proof of this image but thought later that if I did record this image I would of always thought it was a person that I never did find. But because it did not record I now new it was a ghost. It has been over two years, the dvr has been recording non stop 24 hours a day and there has never been a cloud there since.

]]> By: ChazMAz http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/06/22/hunting-the-ghost-hunters/#comment-22280 ChazMAz Tue, 15 Jun 2010 17:23:38 +0000 http://skepticblog.org/?p=3100#comment-22280 What gets me are the "ghosts" that wear clothing and walk up steps. Why would there be ghost clothing. Does clothing have spirits too? What gets me are the “ghosts” that wear clothing and walk up steps.
Why would there be ghost clothing. Does clothing have spirits too?

]]> By: Brady http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/06/22/hunting-the-ghost-hunters/#comment-13868 Brady Mon, 12 Oct 2009 18:21:30 +0000 http://skepticblog.org/?p=3100#comment-13868 I agree with much that is said here. The problem is that the search for paranormal activity is inherently messy. How would you even begin to organize an experiment based on events that are rare and very fleeting? The main group that is subject of this article is ridiculous and I wish you had focused on more prestigious and credible groups such as TAPS (of Ghost Hunters fame). Not that I think they are perfect but they are clearly more professional about looking for answers than the Warrens. I feel like they are good skeptics but are a bit biased in their desire to find something paranormal (as well as keep the show interesting). The show would be more interesting to me still if someone from your group, or someone equally interested in scientific rigor could examine their processes or even appear on their program to help separate the explainable from the truly unexplainable. I agree with much that is said here. The problem is that the search for paranormal activity is inherently messy. How would you even begin to organize an experiment based on events that are rare and very fleeting? The main group that is subject of this article is ridiculous and I wish you had focused on more prestigious and credible groups such as TAPS (of Ghost Hunters fame). Not that I think they are perfect but they are clearly more professional about looking for answers than the Warrens. I feel like they are good skeptics but are a bit biased in their desire to find something paranormal (as well as keep the show interesting). The show would be more interesting to me still if someone from your group, or someone equally interested in scientific rigor could examine their processes or even appear on their program to help separate the explainable from the truly unexplainable.

]]> By: Edward L http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/06/22/hunting-the-ghost-hunters/#comment-11989 Edward L Fri, 28 Aug 2009 14:01:40 +0000 http://skepticblog.org/?p=3100#comment-11989 Guys/Ladies, I am as critical a thinker as the next rational person, with advance tier I university science and engineering degrees. I have made groundbreaking work in my industry by challenging normative and institutional assumptions - and capitalizing on it to make myself very well off. So, I have a life record of keeping my feet on the ground, and an open mind. I have no conclusion whatsoever on ghosts and ghost hunting. I see it on satellite as a form of entertainment. But in this regard, I do see that they are, right or wrong, pulling an end run on the skeptical community and changing hearts and rational minds on this subject with AMPLE contextual and well documented evidence. Now this is not evidence which would match a science standard - but that argument is growing weak and seems more like an excuse. You are losing this argument around the espresso machine/water cooler. Gone are the days when I would hear the skeptical stock answers about ghosts which our parents taught us. The young people in my office are shockingly credulous on this issue in particular. No they are flat out exuberant over it. That does concern me too. Objectivity can be clouded by exuberance and hatred. While I have no conclusion on this subject, I do know one thing. While you sit in ivory think tanks and pontificate one line rationalizations as to why you don't have to look into the subject, you are getting your tail kicked - and by something which is approaching a science practice more and more each day. I don't particularly like this, but you are losing your argument to the general public at large. Guys/Ladies,

I am as critical a thinker as the next rational person, with advance tier I university science and engineering degrees. I have made groundbreaking work in my industry by challenging normative and institutional assumptions – and capitalizing on it to make myself very well off. So, I have a life record of keeping my feet on the ground, and an open mind.

I have no conclusion whatsoever on ghosts and ghost hunting. I see it on satellite as a form of entertainment. But in this regard, I do see that they are, right or wrong, pulling an end run on the skeptical community and changing hearts and rational minds on this subject with AMPLE contextual and well documented evidence. Now this is not evidence which would match a science standard – but that argument is growing weak and seems more like an excuse.

You are losing this argument around the espresso machine/water cooler. Gone are the days when I would hear the skeptical stock answers about ghosts which our parents taught us. The young people in my office are shockingly credulous on this issue in particular. No they are flat out exuberant over it. That does concern me too.

Objectivity can be clouded by exuberance and hatred.

While I have no conclusion on this subject, I do know one thing. While you sit in ivory think tanks and pontificate one line rationalizations as to why you don’t have to look into the subject, you are getting your tail kicked – and by something which is approaching a science practice more and more each day.

I don’t particularly like this, but you are losing your argument to the general public at large.

]]> By: Vanessa http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/06/22/hunting-the-ghost-hunters/#comment-11421 Vanessa Wed, 19 Aug 2009 21:06:35 +0000 http://skepticblog.org/?p=3100#comment-11421 FYI, Mary Roach's book "Spook" has some information on EVP's and their reliability. I don't want to misspeak but she says there are several more mundane explanations such as pareidolia (finding a pattern where none exists) and a phenomenon called "ducting" where radio transmissions get carried far away from their point of origin through some fluke in the atmosphere I won't attempt to explain. Oh and great article by the way. Thanks. FYI, Mary Roach’s book “Spook” has some information on EVP’s and their reliability. I don’t want to misspeak but she says there are several more mundane explanations such as pareidolia (finding a pattern where none exists) and a phenomenon called “ducting” where radio transmissions get carried far away from their point of origin through some fluke in the atmosphere I won’t attempt to explain.

Oh and great article by the way. Thanks.

]]> By: RickFan http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/06/22/hunting-the-ghost-hunters/#comment-11030 RickFan Wed, 12 Aug 2009 15:13:03 +0000 http://skepticblog.org/?p=3100#comment-11030 That is a fine post and not just because I agree with it. It is subjective and shows a pattern of thought that does not assume any outcome. That is, it lets the cards fall where they may. At least one subsequent poster used the word "debunk" in describing research. Scientists and (good) researchers don't debunk they test. Debunking ASSUMES an answer ahead of time and works toward proving it. It is the same as the difference between agnostics and atheists. Agnostics are not convinced either way but are open to the possibilities. Atheists are sure from the start there is no God. Controlled testing (science) strives to allow the facts to present themselves without any predisposition. TAPS and others claim to be skeptics and err on the side of science but freely use the word debunk to describe what they do. Of course their efforts sometimes produce plausible explanations but that serves only to "prove" they are duly diligent, lending more credence to the things they can't (or won't) readily explain. One poster suggested a TV show about skeptics. I would love to see that but unfortunately the truth is seldom as alluring as fantasy. That is a fine post and not just because I agree with it. It is subjective and shows a pattern of thought that does not assume any outcome. That is, it lets the cards fall where they may. At least one subsequent poster used the word “debunk” in describing research. Scientists and (good) researchers don’t debunk they test. Debunking ASSUMES an answer ahead of time and works toward proving it. It is the same as the difference between agnostics and atheists. Agnostics are not convinced either way but are open to the possibilities. Atheists are sure from the start there is no God. Controlled testing (science) strives to allow the facts to present themselves without any predisposition. TAPS and others claim to be skeptics and err on the side of science but freely use the word debunk to describe what they do. Of course their efforts sometimes produce plausible explanations but that serves only to “prove” they are duly diligent, lending more credence to the things they can’t (or won’t) readily explain.

One poster suggested a TV show about skeptics. I would love to see that but unfortunately the truth is seldom as alluring as fantasy.

]]> By: oscar denny http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/06/22/hunting-the-ghost-hunters/#comment-9438 oscar denny Tue, 07 Jul 2009 11:02:00 +0000 http://skepticblog.org/?p=3100#comment-9438 while I consider myself a skeptic. No true scientist could ever say "we have discovered all forms of energy and all states of being". That being said, the scientific method has not let us down. Things common and understood today were considered "magic" only a few hundred years ago. Our understanding is still progressing, and is hopefully being kept in check by the skeptics. It is profoundly naive to think that all the (possible) areas of science have been discovered and established, but conversely, is profoundly scientific to accept that which can only rigorously tested and replicated in controlled settings. Anything else is.....? while I consider myself a skeptic. No true scientist could ever say “we have discovered all forms of energy and all states of being”. That being said, the scientific method has not let us down.

Things common and understood today were considered “magic” only a few hundred years ago. Our understanding is still progressing, and is hopefully being kept in check by the skeptics. It is profoundly naive to think that all the (possible) areas of science have been discovered and established, but conversely, is profoundly scientific to accept that which can only rigorously tested and replicated in controlled settings. Anything else is…..?

]]> By: Roy Edmunds http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/06/22/hunting-the-ghost-hunters/#comment-9437 Roy Edmunds Tue, 07 Jul 2009 10:51:04 +0000 http://skepticblog.org/?p=3100#comment-9437 Mandy hi! I have seen a ghost. That is to say, that, my eyes were open, and I believed I was looking at something, but at the same time I knew the appartion was not 'real'. Not in the sense that you know something you are looking at, has its place in the enviroment where you are situated, and you can see that the object is actually there and is solid. You are aware that you can touch such real things, walk around them. The thing I saw was a man riding a horse at a gallop. I don't know why I saw it, or what it meant to see it. And I am not sure if I actually 'saw' this thing or projected it from my mind or brain, so to speak. Either way it is puzzling. I was very young at the time I saw this event. This sort of event has not happened again in my life. I experienced a kind of constriction of the throat as I saw the man on the horse. IT was all over very quickly. I could not project the moment again. Strange stuff. Years later I learned that a local land owner had died from a fall from a bolting horse in the gully near where I was standing. Who knows? You cannot replicate this stuff. I guess I'll have to live with the mystery. Sure, it was my brain projecting the image. But why? Why there and then? Why did I experience a kind of choking feeling. Someone could tell me I guess. Mandy hi!
I have seen a ghost. That is to say, that, my eyes were open, and I believed I was looking at something, but at the same time I knew the appartion was not ‘real’. Not in the sense that you know something you are looking at, has its place in the enviroment where you are situated, and you can see that the object is actually there and is solid. You are aware that you can touch such real things, walk around them.

The thing I saw was a man riding a horse at a gallop. I don’t know why I saw it, or what it meant to see it. And I am not sure if I actually ‘saw’ this thing or projected it from my mind or brain, so to speak. Either way it is puzzling.

I was very young at the time I saw this event. This sort of event has not happened again in my life.

I experienced a kind of constriction of the throat as I saw the man on the horse. IT was all over very quickly. I could not project the moment again. Strange stuff.
Years later I learned that a local land owner had died from a fall from a bolting horse in the gully near where I was standing.
Who knows? You cannot replicate this stuff.
I guess I’ll have to live with the mystery.
Sure, it was my brain projecting the image. But why? Why there and then? Why did I experience a kind of choking feeling.

Someone could tell me I guess.

]]> By: Mandy http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/06/22/hunting-the-ghost-hunters/#comment-9159 Mandy Mon, 29 Jun 2009 04:35:27 +0000 http://skepticblog.org/?p=3100#comment-9159 Hello, I have spent a good part of the afternoon researching the various paranormal groups out there and stumbled across quite a few skeptically inclined sites. I myself am a paranormal investigator and view the entire field as an area to be looked at, probed and researched. I have conducted investigations, I have used what equipment(however humble) is out there and I have had personal experiences, taken photogaphs,and captured EVP'S that I cannot explain rationally. Are they ghosts, of course not! There is no way I can explain anything I have discovered as being a ghost as, to date, there are no bona-fide 'ghosts' anywhere that I can compare them with. However, even though they are phenomena that I can't explain today, I look forward to a time when, like many scientific theories, they can be explained logically or otherwise. Until then I will continue to enjoy my research, much of which involves debunking, I don't take money for what I do, and many people thank me for showing them that the'moaning woman's voice' in the back bedroom is in fact a dog barking three doors down. There are many many charlatans out there taking advantage of people but Im sure there are many more sensible, serious, curious people like me just trying to find answers. p.s. orbs are dust...end of story! Thank you Hello,
I have spent a good part of the afternoon researching the various paranormal groups out there and stumbled across quite a few skeptically inclined sites. I myself am a paranormal investigator and view the entire field as an area to be looked at, probed and researched. I have conducted investigations, I have used what equipment(however humble) is out there and I have had personal experiences, taken photogaphs,and captured EVP’S that I cannot explain rationally. Are they ghosts, of course not! There is no way I can explain anything I have discovered as being a ghost as, to date, there are no bona-fide ‘ghosts’ anywhere that I can compare them with. However, even though they are phenomena that I can’t explain today, I look forward to a time when, like many scientific theories, they can be explained logically or otherwise. Until then I will continue to enjoy my research, much of which involves debunking, I don’t take money for what I do, and many people thank me for showing them that the’moaning woman’s voice’ in the back bedroom is in fact a dog barking three doors down. There are many many charlatans out there taking advantage of people but Im sure there are many more sensible, serious, curious people like me just trying to find answers.
p.s. orbs are dust…end of story!

Thank you

]]> By: Devil's Advocate http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/06/22/hunting-the-ghost-hunters/#comment-9090 Devil's Advocate Fri, 26 Jun 2009 16:56:04 +0000 http://skepticblog.org/?p=3100#comment-9090 It also implies that the Holy Trinity wear watches or have clocks, all set by Earth humans' AM/PM method of 60 secs = minute, 60 mins = hour, 24 hrs = day, etc. Who knew? It also implies that the Holy Trinity wear watches or have clocks, all set by Earth humans’ AM/PM method of 60 secs = minute, 60 mins = hour, 24 hrs = day, etc. Who knew?

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