Comments on: Bold Claims in Press About Acupuncture http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/05/12/acupuncture/ The official blog of the Skeptologists Sat, 11 Feb 2012 21:38:44 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: saurab http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/05/12/acupuncture/#comment-10304 saurab Mon, 27 Jul 2009 16:05:58 +0000 http://skepticblog.org/?p=2557#comment-10304 I hope you dont mind...... but if I were to suggest that you yourself take an acupuncture treatment from a good acupuncturist who has a good track record, for some problem that you may have (if you have one), then you may be able to better gauge the effectiveness of the healing modality. Without such a personal exposure to the healing modality, it would be left to the gathering of logic and evidence to deny or accept the usefulness of acupuncture. Is it not ? Why not be the evidence, instead of gathering some ? Thanks, Saurab PS: I have never taken an acupuncture treatment in my life, soi I have no personal agenda with regards to the same. I do however practice another form of healing, Reiki, which is also an alternative healing modality, and I personally know that it is effective. Just wanted to mention in this. I hope you dont mind…… but if I were to suggest that you yourself take an acupuncture treatment from a good acupuncturist who has a good track record, for some problem that you may have (if you have one), then you may be able to better gauge the effectiveness of the healing modality.

Without such a personal exposure to the healing modality, it would be left to the gathering of logic and evidence to deny or accept the usefulness of acupuncture. Is it not ?

Why not be the evidence, instead of gathering some ?

Thanks,
Saurab

PS: I have never taken an acupuncture treatment in my life, soi I have no personal agenda with regards to the same. I do however practice another form of healing, Reiki, which is also an alternative healing modality, and I personally know that it is effective.

Just wanted to mention in this.

]]> By: Max http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/05/12/acupuncture/#comment-7780 Max Mon, 18 May 2009 21:55:15 +0000 http://skepticblog.org/?p=2557#comment-7780 How do you know that sham acupuncture is no better than a placebo effect? How do you know that sham acupuncture is no better than a placebo effect?

]]> By: The Blind Watchmaker http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/05/12/acupuncture/#comment-7736 The Blind Watchmaker Sun, 17 May 2009 14:21:46 +0000 http://skepticblog.org/?p=2557#comment-7736 This really just shows that accupuncture has the same efficacy as the placebo effect since "sham" accupuncture seems to work too. This really just shows that accupuncture has the same efficacy as the placebo effect since “sham” accupuncture seems to work too.

]]> By: Chris Kavanagh http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/05/12/acupuncture/#comment-7730 Chris Kavanagh Sun, 17 May 2009 08:31:09 +0000 http://skepticblog.org/?p=2557#comment-7730 Correction in the study standard treatment was still supplied so Acupuncture/Fake Acupuncture + Standard Treatment worked better than just Standard Treatment. Pretty straightforward given what we know about the placebo. Standard Treatment + Elaborate medical ritual provides more relief than just Standard Treatment. Doesn't make the elaborate medical ritual any less of a placebo. Correction in the study standard treatment was still supplied so Acupuncture/Fake Acupuncture + Standard Treatment worked better than just Standard Treatment.

Pretty straightforward given what we know about the placebo.

Standard Treatment + Elaborate medical ritual provides more relief than just Standard Treatment.

Doesn’t make the elaborate medical ritual any less of a placebo.

]]> By: Chris Kavanagh http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/05/12/acupuncture/#comment-7729 Chris Kavanagh Sun, 17 May 2009 08:28:08 +0000 http://skepticblog.org/?p=2557#comment-7729 I have. I found it very relaxing (they put a heater over me after the needles were in) and it made me feel better for a short time after. The problem I received treatment for (a shoulder injury) is still with me however and even if it wasn't as a good skeptic I'm well aware that anecdotes don't trump clinical evidence. Valuing personal experience above clinical studies is how we ended up with loads of medical treatments that either do nothing or are harmful in the first place. I have. I found it very relaxing (they put a heater over me after the needles were in) and it made me feel better for a short time after. The problem I received treatment for (a shoulder injury) is still with me however and even if it wasn’t as a good skeptic I’m well aware that anecdotes don’t trump clinical evidence.

Valuing personal experience above clinical studies is how we ended up with loads of medical treatments that either do nothing or are harmful in the first place.

]]> By: Max http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/05/12/acupuncture/#comment-7721 Max Sun, 17 May 2009 02:53:42 +0000 http://skepticblog.org/?p=2557#comment-7721 "acupuncture works just as well as no treatment." What do you mean by "no treatment"? No intervention? Even a placebo works better than that. In the study cited by Ryan Johnson, acupuncture worked better than standard medical care alone. “acupuncture works just as well as no treatment.”

What do you mean by “no treatment”? No intervention? Even a placebo works better than that. In the study cited by Ryan Johnson, acupuncture worked better than standard medical care alone.

]]> By: MadScientist http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/05/12/acupuncture/#comment-7706 MadScientist Sat, 16 May 2009 07:40:25 +0000 http://skepticblog.org/?p=2557#comment-7706 We don't need to have needles stuck in us to say that acupuncture is a load of nonsense; even (at least some) Chinese physicians from over 100 years ago knew it was a load of rubbish and would advise their patients not to go for it. How people today can still believe in the nonsense which previous generations had refuted is really quite bizarre. There are already a number of legitimate and almost-legitimate studies (like the one reported here) which show that acupuncture works just as well as no treatment. We don’t need to have needles stuck in us to say that acupuncture is a load of nonsense; even (at least some) Chinese physicians from over 100 years ago knew it was a load of rubbish and would advise their patients not to go for it. How people today can still believe in the nonsense which previous generations had refuted is really quite bizarre. There are already a number of legitimate and almost-legitimate studies (like the one reported here) which show that acupuncture works just as well as no treatment.

]]> By: tmac57 http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/05/12/acupuncture/#comment-7692 tmac57 Fri, 15 May 2009 21:26:00 +0000 http://skepticblog.org/?p=2557#comment-7692 pamela- What difference would that make concerning whether or not a procedure can produce a measurable clinical effect other than placebo,in a blinded study? Anecdotes are not useful in science except as a suggestion for some effect that might need studying. Acupuncture has been studied to death, and thus far,keeps coming up empty handed. pamela- What difference would that make concerning whether or not a procedure can produce a measurable clinical effect other than placebo,in a blinded study? Anecdotes are not useful in science except as a suggestion for some effect that might need studying. Acupuncture has been studied to death, and thus far,keeps coming up empty handed.

]]> By: pamela http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/05/12/acupuncture/#comment-7690 pamela Fri, 15 May 2009 20:32:42 +0000 http://skepticblog.org/?p=2557#comment-7690 has anyone contributing to this discussion actually tried acupuncture? or are you all talking about something that you know nothing about? has anyone contributing to this discussion actually tried acupuncture? or are you all talking about something that you know nothing about?

]]> By: Wheelst http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/05/12/acupuncture/#comment-7634 Wheelst Thu, 14 May 2009 22:49:14 +0000 http://skepticblog.org/?p=2557#comment-7634 Orac did a great job of destroying this study. http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2009/05/another_acupuncture_study_misinterpreted.php Orac did a great job of destroying this study.
http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2009/05/another_acupuncture_study_misinterpreted.php

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